No ABS feedback / opinions...

[dazzor]

Risk compensation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Anti-lock brakes

Anti-lock braking systems are designed to increase vehicle safety by reducing skidding.

A number of studies show that drivers of vehicles with ABS tend to drive faster, follow closer and brake later, accounting for the failure of ABS to result in any measurable improvement in road safety. The studies were performed in Canada, Denmark, and Germany.[12][13][14] A study led by Fred Mannering, a professor of civil engineering at Purdue University supports risk compensation, terming it the "offset hypothesis".[15] A study of crashes involving taxicabs in Munich of which half had been equipped with anti-lock brakes noted that crash rate was substantially the same for both types of cab, and concluded this was due to drivers of ABS-equipped cabs taking more risks.[16]

However, the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety released a study in 2010 that found motorcycles with ABS 37% less likely to be involved in a fatal crash than models without ABS.[17] A 2004 study found that ABS reduced the risk of multiple vehicle crashes by 18 percent, but had increased the risk of run-off-road crashes by 35 percent.[18

Very interesting. I do wonder if it will subliminally alter my attitude towards my riding. The last 2 accidents I have had have definitely changed my approach to riding....I doubt ABS will override that.

Maybe I'll get some hypnotherapy to convince me I am riding a non ABS bike even though really I am....would that be the best of both worlds then?

 

[sdrio]

Very interesting. I do wonder if it will subliminally alter my attitude towards my riding. The last 2 accidents I have had have definitely changed my approach to riding....I doubt ABS will override that.

Maybe I'll get some hypnotherapy to convince me I am riding a non ABS bike even though really I am....would that be the best of both worlds then?

I don't think it's something we should worry about too much. I'm just saying we shouldn't come to think of ABS as some kind of miracle cure all.

I think it's common ground that our safety is our own responsibility, regardless of what gadgetry we have.

 

[dazzor]

I don't think it's something we should worry about too much. I'm just saying we shouldn't come to think of ABS as some kind of miracle cure all.

I think it's common ground that our safety is our own responsibility, regardless of what gadgetry we have.

You're talking to the converted....I mean that in a nice way

I've not seen any posts on here to suggest it's a huge safety net.

You earlier said, just a few posts back you've only got ABS because it's all the dealer had. £400 for a very real, extra safety factor is what it comes down to surely?

You're scenario being the polar opposite from my situation....I could have walked away with non ABS today, instead I am waiting about 4 months now. Why, because I want to know I've done all I can to be safe....The operative word being ALL in that sentence......So ABS being just ONE factor.

£400 and possibly a bit of wait for what, a bit more safety......Errm?......Yes please

 

[sdrio]

You're talking to the converted....I mean that in a nice way

I've not seen any posts on here to suggest it's a huge safety net.

You earlier said, just a few posts back you've only got ABS because it's all the dealer had. £400 for a very real, extra safety factor is what it comes down to surely?

You're scenario being the polar opposite from my situation....I could have walked away with non ABS today, instead I am waiting about 4 months now. Why, because I want to know I've done all I can to be safe....The operative word being ALL in that sentence......So ABS being just ONE factor.

£400 and possible a bit of wait for what, a bit more safety......Errm?......Yes please

Maybe I am being a bit overly critical of ABS, I'm not actually against it. I think you've made a wise decision, and a patient one!

ABS in some circumstances can mitigate problems, and for sure some of those times it will be the difference between a disaster and only needing a change of underwear. For that reason, it's worth having.

At the risk of repeating myself, I just take the attitude that if you need ABS, you probably need to re-evaluate how you ride. Of course you could say the same for tread on tyres, and wearing a crash helmet. Anything that makes us safer is good.

My other concern is that ABS systems on bikes have from time to time been unreliable. On some used BMWs, the ABS models sell for less than the non ABS versions because they are prone to failure.

 

[Deleted member 20]

How about this then.....
Thanks, Anders, you've made the difference for me.

Way yo go! Almost got a tear in my eye reading your post
Anders

 

[dazzor]

Sidro;

I think we're on the same page mate

Been riding 25 years now, but, we never stop learning. I'm always reevaluating things, especially how I ride

Yes, ABS can fail, it's like everything else in this realm of existence, it's not infallible.

Enjoy your ABS MT-07....ya lucky sod!

 

[dazzor]

Way yo go! Almost got a tear in my eye reading your post
Anders

Ha ha, stop it! You'll have me at it too

 

[Deleted member 20]

Sample research docs on the topic.

http://www-esv.nhtsa.dot.gov/Proceedings/23/files/23ESV-000169.PDF
http://www.iihs.org/frontend/iihs/documents/masterfiledocs.ashx?id=2042

 

[pengjn]

How about this then.....

I've literally just come back from my dealers as they had my brand new, non ABS matt grey ready for me to collect......I walked away without the bike and called a stop to the deal just before handing over the payment...because I came to my senses and would rather wait for an ABS model.

I've been riding 24 years without it, had quite a few offs over the years, some bad, some not so bad. This will be my first bike with ABS and I'm prepared to now have to wait until October for the colour I want.

Anders: your post about riding so long without ABS then the last 7 years with it, plus that nasty accident you had that meant losing a kidney....plus the stats you've quoted have really made me think.

For the last 2 weeks, since placing an order and reading stuff on here, I have been kicking myself internally. For the last 3.5 years I've been a Dad.....that alone changes everything.

I know we see these tests where in good, dry conditions ABS takes a greater distance to stop, but the in real world, when a muppet pulls directly in front of you with very little distance to stop I tend to grab handfuls of front-brake. Sure, ask me to perform an emergency stop and I can break with the best of them...Because I am calm and not panicked.

I'm not saying the Non-ABS option is a mugs game, I'm just saying me personally, I'm elated that I displayed some discipline and walked away from a shiny new bike today in the quest for safety. If I wasn't a Dad, I think I would be riding around right now on my new, non ABS MT-07...the weather here in Hertfordshire (UK) today is marvellous too


Thanks, Anders, you've made the difference for me.

Total respect to you sir - in my view absolutely the right decision. MT-07 w/ ABS will be my first bike and I would not have elected to buy any bike without it.

 

[sdrio]

Sidro;

I think we're on the same page mate

Been riding 25 years now, but, we never stop learning. I'm always reevaluating things, especially how I ride

Yes, ABS can fail, it's like everything else in this realm of existence, it's not infallible.

Enjoy your ABS MT-07....ya lucky sod!

We're definitely on the same page!

ABS or not, you're going to enjoy it. Just a shame about the summer though. Ouch! I assume you've got something else at the moment?

 

[dazzor]

Total respect to you sir - in my view absolutely the right decision. MT-07 w/ ABS will be my first bike and I would not have elected to buy any bike without it.

Thanks mate, appreciate that.

You know, I'm really quite happy now and once I made my intentions known to my dealer ( thanks Woodford Motorcycles) I felt a huge weight lifted off me...so I knew I'd done the right thing.

My dealer has been great, they will have to de-register the bike, they didn't have to do that.

Great forum this!

 

[Peter]

+1 vote for ABS. Lifesaver.

Some of us thinking about to buy new exhaust for his/her bike. The price of the ABS option is only half of an Akra. If you can pay the Akra, you can pay the ABS.

 

[dazzor]

We're definitely on the same page!

ABS or not, you're going to enjoy it. Just a shame about the summer though. Ouch! I assume you've got something else at the moment?

Yes mate, back on my XJ6N

It's a decent enough bike; bought after getting paid out on my written-off Street-Triple R, last June. I just wanted a cheap, decent commuter with enough power to get the 36-mile a day, round trip done....which it does well.

It ain't no 07 though. Such a fun bike!

 

[xt660isgood2]

ABS is it really that neccesary?

Apols in advance as I've never ridden a bike with ABS so prob don't know jack sh@t about it. But have driven many cars with it.
Apparently all new bikes in Germany are all abs. And theres a gent on here who wants an mt any colour as long as it's abs.
Also I here in the coming years the uk will only sell abs all bikes.
Am I having a really senior thing here but if you are riding a bike and u lock up.... just take your foot/ hand off it?
Hope it's more fun on a bike than in a car on black ice lol

 

[dazzor]

Apols in advance as I've never ridden a bike with ABS so prob don't know jack sh@t about it. But have driven many cars with it.
Apparently all new bikes in Germany are all abs. And theres a gent on here who wants an mt any colour as long as it's abs.
Also I here in the coming years the uk will only sell abs all bikes.
Am I having a really senior thing here but if you are riding a bike and u lock up.... just take your foot/ hand off it?
Hope it's more fun on a bike than in a car on black ice lol

ETA threads merged. Will.

One thing I will say, I don't know about you but when a real life hazzard presents itself, like a car pulling right in front of you with little distance to react, I instantly grab a handful of front brake.....that in the past has sent the back wheel up, so applying the back becomes a non-option.

I suspect from your post that you've been riding a long time, I like to think I'm reasonably experienced with 25 years in the saddle.....most of that time spent riding at least 5 days a week, in and out of London....I still am not good enough to say I can do better than ABS in a panicked situation....never mind in the wet....Just my view on it.

For £400 and pssibly a bit of wait, it's a no brainer for me......This being my first ABS bike ever.....When I eventually get it.

 

[cosmikdebriis]

I chose non ABS but can understand why others might choose otherwise. I also ride old Brit bikes so any brakes at all seem like an improvement.

Of course, if I suddenly disappear from the forum... You'll know I made the wrong choice.

 

[jordatron]

had a bit of a brown trousers moment today when i didn't see the red light at slow speed and i still managed to lock the rear up, really gotta watch how heavy i am with that right foot.

 

[cosmikdebriis]

Well today, whilst adding a few more miles on the clock and making the most of the nice weather. I was riding up out of Swanage along a pretty narrow street when a nice young lady in a Peugeot decided that, rather than run over a carton of eggs that someone had dropped on her side of the road, she would drive around it on my side of the road, heading straight at me and, instead of looking where she was going, have a good look at the egg carton and smashed eggs.

I'm not sure who looked more frightened. Me or her kid in the back seat but luckily I managed to brake heavily and swerve to avoid the collision.

She gave me a cheery wave as we passed. (don't they all after nearly killing you).

Kinda reminded me of those 70's "Think Bike" public information films.

 

[dazzor]

Did the ABS kick-in?

Pleased it ended well mate.

 

[sdrio]

Well today, whilst adding a few more miles on the clock and making the most of the nice weather. I was riding up out of Swanage along a pretty narrow street when a nice young lady in a Peugeot decided that, rather than run over a carton of eggs that someone had dropped on her side of the road, she would drive around it on my side of the road, heading straight at me and, instead of looking where she was going, have a good look at the egg carton and smashed eggs.

I'm not sure who looked more frightened. Me or her kid in the back seat but luckily I managed to brake heavily and swerve to avoid the collision.

She gave me a cheery wave as we passed. (don't they all after nearly killing you).

Kinda reminded me of those 70's "Think Bike" public information films.

Aw man, what a place to be riding.

I used to keep a Hobie Cat at Studland. We spent just about every summer weekend down there.